hello :)

Hi everyone

hi!

Hi!

Hi Juliana

where is everyone from?

Hi everyone. Not quite sure how this all works!…

Milton Keynes

London

Hi

Hi

Hello

Hi everybody, from Edinburgh (French)

London :)

Hey, it's my first time on zoom. Do we need to turn the video and mic on?

Nope, don’t need to. We will be introducing ourselves slightly later

Cool, cheers

Hi, Pat from France; hope I can follow the meeting with my english

no audio yet but working on it.

with you shortly

image is flashing, is that just me?

Hi Pat, let me know if translation is needed. Not that I'm 100% fluent but OK.

i am having issues too

Good intro session, nice idea to meet in smaller groups at the start

what's the point in breakout groups? Ours didn't work as most people didn't have audio

you have to unmute to speak :)

and check your mic is selected to the correct input

was great to meet in small groups- especially as I can’t get to meetings etc

we knew that, but not everyone is familiar with Zoom.

i'm off...i can't work it out. alas.

anamizm icons at top right of page

Break out groups are used so everyone can get to know each other a bit more. Apologies if the room didn’t work for you

Video that Keith mentioned from Ireland- See this short film about how citizens in Ireland resolved political deadlock over abortion rights; the same assembly which recommended a bold programme of measures to tackle the climate emergency:https://www.thejournal.ie/citizens-assembly-climate-change…/

great thanks

Great, thanks x

Apologies wrong link- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjpuDk9_BWI

no icons at top right, no idea what animizm icon is. can't hear anything. no idea how to get this to work. I've cancelled other things to be at home to find out more. unfortunately very disappointing. 😏

If you're on mobile, the icons might be at the bottom, trying tapping on screen. Select Device Audio

my icons bottom left, move mouse over screen, click the down arrow next to mic symbol and check your input

animizm is a person, Karen. Can you see any icons anywhere on your page?

can this slide show be shared? be great to refer to!

It works now for me. Just open audio management and unmute my mic

Yes we can share presentation and recording afterwards :)

for me, the icon at the bottom right

Sorry to hear you are having tech issues Karen!

icons at bottom won't do anything. been trying for almost half an hour, time to give up I think. have fun.

I'm eager to hear more about the planned transport sortition in Cambridge -- Lauren Stabler

Can you say what the eviedence is for 45 being representatve, Keith? cheers!

Representative not just of local residents... but in the "Travel to Work' area... or beyond.

Can anyone join in to a CA?

youre seclected at random, Nick.

Great presentation

Keith: how does the selection work to ensure that very different areas (eg very poor, very welathy) are equally represented?

AMAZING! Thank you :-)

Thanks Kieth, could you give your email address again, I didn't have the time to write it down (?)

Is it possible to change in Carl Lam's group?

Sorry I have to leave now. Thank you was really interesting

I'm still on the main conversation, not in a group :/

Not sure if you can hear me, weird

That's a shame. I'm on Linux, might be the cause. Sorry. I just had 2 questions about (i) how to make sure we're fully representative of the people when selecting for sortition and (ii) how to make sure it's working, as an example, petrol lobbies might divert the decisions that need to be taken on climate change..

Just in case it can be answered now.

we have some!

I'm on Linux too. Drop me an email keith@sortitionfoundation.org

would XR citizens assemblies be debuting how to get to zero emissions

I can feedback from the breakout group that I was in.

hey Paul

Useful chat. Several questions, primarily with regard to getting balanced representation from experts and the public in assemblies?

Hi guys please drop your questions in here!

from our group- who would decide what issues to take to a CA?

I'd like to know what is the precise relationship between the citizens assmebly and UK Gov? Will the citizens assembly have power, or are they essentially an advisory group (which the government could theoretically ignore)?

If you do statistical analysis in psychology 45 is a good, statistical sampla

*or nieither

ok and like Chris, how do you ensure you have all communities (eg rich and poor etc etc) equally/fairly represented?

So from what he is saying it seems like the selection process could be gerrymandered

Who decides what evidence is provided, and who proposes the question/s for deliberation?

Nice to take part i have to go now. Good luck and catch you soon

our question similar to Justine’s - would be just be deciding how to get to zero emissiins

emissions

Do you do a real proportional of society or is the proportion distorted so that minorities are more represented?

What is its legal status? The status of the recommendations?

Assuming citizens assmebly is established, how long will they be in place for, and what mechanism will exist to ensure government follows through on their actions?

Representative of group might be possible but we were concerned/wondering how you cover different geographical needs e.g. mountain isolated v. city?

who decides on which issues ‘deserve’ a sortition group?

Thanks

How to ensure the “other than human” is represented?

good question

great question Davis

that’s a great question David!!!

Yes! Good question…

(Kates question - I just wrote it!!)

is it mandaotryhow do they deal with no showshow do they deal complex that maybe everyday people dont understanddoes descsion need to be unamioushow do we manke sure that centrailsed power controlling proccesss doesnt become corropthow do we select expertshow do we deal imminate issues that dont have the time for sortisitioncan CA worked in tandem on same issue

yes- love that q David

Who is doing the selection and the interview?

Would / could sortition be used to selected the 'experts' to guard against vested interests?

what is meant by the "outside body" that selects the experts? And how would it be insured that the selected experts are balanced and really represent all sides of the problem. not only for example capitalist interests regarding the problem etc

Are there examples of where children have been included? (important for decisions about the future)

Are there any obstacles to participating, such as a criminal record disbars you from jury service? Who would decide on eligibility criteria?

Good questions regarding children Jeremy

can it be done remotely for housebound people to participate?

how do you select the experts and ensure that their expertise is balanced?

Question that came out of my group: 1. Is climate change, as opposed to abortion, too complex and broad for decisions to be made in this way? 2. How do you mitigate for the effect of media and lobbyists which affect people’s decision making in our current system?

so do you definitely not use random selection?

Can you define the XR Citizens Assembly and how it's being driven?

For sortition, the selection of 'stakeholder groups' can easily be contested and made political. How can we allow members of the public to feed into the selection of stakeholder groups (i.e., sortition categories) without allowing to become political?

Given the urgency of these crises. esp. climate change, wouldn't this take a bit long?

The fact that it is totally transparrent helps hugely with guarding againt vested interests

Have assemblies that have taken place so far worked on deadline?

The money needed to fund a sortition group - what is it used for exactly? Presumambly everyone is there voluntarily and not being paid, so is it spent on venue, admin? Or are people paid to be there?

Is there any place for a group of “tribal elders” who overview the entire thing - maybe the deliberation facilitators - to ensure fair play on all parts?

a concern I’ve come across is how to ensure facilitators are truly independent - and seen to be so by the wider public.

Yes all CA process is overseen by trained facilitators

sorry question was not xr ca but general use

Is there a way we could recreate the model within our smaller groups in XR, so we are practicing what we are preaching?

I had a problem getting logged in until after half way through. Will there be a recording of this that I can replay?

Yes there will be a recording

Yes I think its being recorded, David!

Sorry peeps had a non climate emergency to attend to

Cam facilitators for me would be those who are more able to host independently without imparting a personal bias. Not an easy thing to learn but many are more able than others. Transparrency again helps keeps tabs on this

Thank you

We're already working on encouraging (vigorously) ur local council to create a CA in Cornwall.

if the outcome of the citizens assembly does not concur with the ideals of xr, will xr still campaign for the outcome?

if we say ok, now let’s bring in the climate scientists to present their evidence on climate change, and options to get to zero greenhouse gases. How do we pick from amongst climate scientists to present to the citizens assembly?

Having an issue with my computer, I can't hear a thing. Kieth, I'll email you. Thank you very much for this call and your answers, it's really interesting and useful. See you all, bye!

In essence, ideally, we would set up our own CA's to pressure local authorities with local, national and international issues and use NVDA to ensure our aims are implemented?

There was a question about how we can run smaller versions of CAs ourselves and practice what we preach. There are offerings of such self run events, Talk Shop is one and Thinking Box another. I look after the latter and work with TS closely. Be happy to support anyone wanting to run an event

Won't a representative cross section of UK societty want to continue driving cars?

email me on paul@thinkingbox.info

Thats interesting, Paul, thanks. :)

Anne Marie- if they are charged with sorting zero carbon then they won’t be able to choose that option or will have to work out how to make zero carbon vehicles work

we dont think you're terrible at this Keith - we think you are doing great!

I'll secnod that : )

second that Kate!

😂

age for sortition?

Doesn’t the criminal record depend on the crime -you wouldn’t want convicted bent politicians and fraudsters for example…

I was thnking the same, David.

+1

please say what contact email is for XR-citizensassembly workinggroup is.

yes please could I also have that email

Citizens assemblies are expensive and time consuming we won’t be doing it casually

xr-CitizensAssembly@gmail.com

But there could be lost of things appropriate at local level that could be decided by a local CA.

isnt the point that normal political means don’t work

I agree Manda

One small counter to that though is that for people to back CAs it might be good for people to have an experience of a meeting being run in a CA type way

Sortition website and participedia

Splendid, that's the answer I wanted. Cheers. How do we ensure the XR CA is able to force national gov to implement or do we just change the parliamentary system??!! (please say yes)

I don’t agree with a single, National Assembly telling central government as that would continue a system of top down, whereby Councils would do the minimum to comply, rather than the maimum

*maximum

I've just checked - looks like the email address is protonmail.com (not gmail). So it's ' xr-CitizensAssembly@protonmail.com '

Local CAs on local issues (not national) coul dbe a great way to support local decision making

yes, decentralised assemblies, kinda federalist....

Have to go. Thanks a lot guys. Very helpful#

and a duty, as Yanis Varofakis talks of, in DiEM 25

I’m inclined to promote the idea that change begins at home. So if Council after Council more or less overrides central government in doing what must be done (e.g. banning fracking), we’re a lot closer to a real notion of democracy alrteady

devolved ca’s

Scotland and Wales an nI might baulk at centralised

any final questions or messages of support for Keith? ^__^

Zackly

Keith = boss

i think XR are right to aim high first, and then implement CA's at local level. We are time restricted. It is important to build political direction from the grass roots but we need national and international change on these issues

Thank you very much for your time and enthusiasm xx

thanks Kieth. great workshop

Thanks Keith, will definitely look into this more!

Great workshop, big thanks to XR and Keith

A lot of us are qustioing the one central CA model. Can Keith respond to why there would be no valu ein a local function?? :)

how do housebound people take part?

If it needs funding to happen then how can local or central CAs happen without the say so of governments?

*value in*

thanks everyone very worthwhile

Thanks though, interesting chat, worthwhile and inspirational

Thanks for arranging this - interesting and hopefuly useful

Thanks! I think it is important to v

Perhaps we should have an online mini assembly on here?

Great question Justine about 'how do housebound people get involved'?

I'd be happy to help

that’s helpful - a or b -

I’d love a mini-assembly!

Thanks! I think it is important to compare with what we have now. Maybe this is not ideal, but what we have now is worse. We cannot compare with the best ever thing that doesn’t exist yet

Brilliant1 Thank you everyone. Don’t underestimate people’s ability to understand complex issues if time is taken to explain and they feel valued.

What about local CAs on local issues? Eg pot holes? or local bypass?

nothing will be here if we dont stop climate disaster

I THINK IN CORNWALL WE ARE THINKING the local citizens assembly is not about XR BUT ABOUT THE LOCAL COUNCIL DECLARATION OF EMERGENCY and supporting them in meeting it

Really interesting, thanks, Keith - and Robin. I think I might completely disagree about the local CA but keen to know more! :)

Brilliant!!

hanks for all

Ta dude

👏👏👏

thanks all.

Incredibly informative. And so much food for thought

thanks! brilliant meeting

Thanks to you too Jamie

agree, thanks very much!

Thank you!

Thank you so much!

thank you so much :)

woop woop!

Wonderful

Great work thank you so much

yes great to learn more about citizens assemblies

Thank you so much Keith. Totally get we need to demonstrate an exemplary CA across the country, rather than local - structure and facilitation critical.

Well done Robin

thanks]

Thank you