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Webinar: Distance Education – Volume 41/4, 2020 - Shared screen with speaker view
Philip Schiff
29:58
Have Institutions done enough to ensure students have connectivity to enable them to access their courses?
Thomas Reeves
31:06
Here in the States, we are seeing more and more reports like this one. https://www.wfsb.com/news/thousands-of-distance-learners-arent-logging-on-report-shows/article_00c417aa-130b-11eb-a587-3bf7bddc4e3c.html
Philip Schiff
32:15
Thank you. We're seeing the same here in Australia
Debra Hoven
32:39
@Philip - I wonder if it’s institutions or governments - and thinking outside of boxes on the part of teachers/educators when governments/institutions can’t meet technological connectivities …
Philip Schiff
35:44
Thanks Debra. It's a great question. Our experience here has been that Government's have left Universities to fend for themselves. It's political. The Govt response to Covid has been purely wage subsidy (Jobkeeper) not EduSaver
Ana-Paula Correia
36:53
if you are interested in reading our article: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/01587919.2020.1821607
George Veletsianos
37:48
Following Ana’s great idea to share her work, here’s mine: https://doi.org/10.1080/01587919.2020.1825066 :)
Philip Schiff
38:06
Great, thank you both
Philip Schiff
40:49
Christine and Philippa - What impact has Covid-19 had on student enrolments and participation on the Open University?
Debra Hoven
42:11
@Philippa - we should connect - I have (pre-COVID) incorporated a Mindfulness module our one of my MEd courses - & have a similar module on biorhythms with my doctoral students :-)
Philip Schiff
43:19
Great Debra (thanks) . I'll reach out after this great Webinar
Mark Brown
44:35
Just a brief promo before I head off to bed here in Ireland to let you know that ODLAA in partnership with FLANZ is launching inaugural Australasian Open and Distance Learning Week (2-9 November). This initiative also partners with EDEN and coincides with European Online and Distance Learning Week. A series of 13 webinars will be available over the course of the week. See… https://odlaa.org/odlaa_events/australasian-online-and-distance-learning-week/
Debra Hoven
55:27
That’s for sure Jon!!
Mark Brown
56:24
I have talked with QS on several occasions about establishing a separate league table (their language not mine) and for better and worse it’s on their action list
Debra Hoven
57:02
But also we need to consider - especially in Australia & Canada from which I can speak - how is connectivity for some of our remote (not emergency) students?
Mark Brown
57:30
We do now have university rankings for SDGS
Alanieta Lesuma-Fatiaki
57:41
Would it be something that is well placed for organisations such as ICDE, COL and of similar standing lobby, advocate for re: rankings at the global level?
Philip Schiff
57:42
Well put Debra and brilliant comments George (thanks Mark)
George Veletsianos
58:04
Great comment from Mark re SDGs and rankings
Debra Hoven
58:29
I don’t seem to have audio rights?
Mark Brown
59:08
Yes it appears attendees don’t have audio or video rights and this is something I will follow up on with Jay in ODLAA
Debra Hoven
59:19
Thx Mark!
Debra Hoven
01:00:03
@Som - we have several students at AU working on “post-COVID” state of teaching …
Alanieta Lesuma-Fatiaki
01:01:39
@Mark Brown, Zoom Webinar has been used here rather than Zoom Meetings so video and audio rights are disabled by default but can be enabled by the host.
Debra Hoven
01:02:46
@Ana - great comments! I have been using synchronous communications in support of Indigenous land-based education :)
Mark Brown
01:04:09
Another promo that may be of interest to some is the forthcoming DigiEduHack which is supported by the European Commission. Still time for teams to sign up from around the world… https://digieduhack.com/en/
Debra Hoven
01:04:39
@Philippa - we did similar things for our doctoral orientation - and I put together some virtual tours and interviews with people for students to look at ahead of time - and then had brief Q&A sessions post-viewing
Philip Schiff
01:05:29
I feel dynamic Universities will use Covid to evolve their offerings, so as to more aggressively Globalise. Massification requires it, as the old Bricks and Mortar approach has limitations and is less profitable.
Mark Brown
01:06:02
Fantastic opportunities for online role-pay!
Philip Schiff
01:06:13
Absolutely Mark
Debra Hoven
01:06:37
I was invited to speak with faculty at a university in Germany about how to “move online” and one of their comments when I showed my course site was “I don’t think we could be so personal” … so there are intercultural differences to consider also
Philip Schiff
01:07:54
I believe their gains will be short-lived unless they evolve to provide more effective student support. Historical attrition rates for Online/Distance learning was significantly higher than on-campus, therefore we hope they learn from Einstein
Philip Schiff
01:08:26
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
Mark Brown
01:09:43
Do we really think traditional universities are going to change their promotion criteria, workload models, etc. by valuing online teaching in response to the Covid-19 experience?
Robert Bromber
01:10:12
And who will make the administration understand the seminal change-they don't handle unlearning well.
Debra Hoven
01:10:55
@Mark - I’ve also been wondering that - which is why we are encouraging our research students to explore those post-COVID aspects ...
Mark Brown
01:10:56
On a more positive note, some of us are trying to be subversive some the inside!
Mark Brown
01:11:14
from the inside
Debra Hoven
01:11:43
Subversives and disruptors unite!
Mark Brown
01:12:23
I spent a day last week serving on an academic promotions panel and the move online wasn’t a big topic of discusison
Mark Brown
01:13:02
Yes €12m
Debra Hoven
01:14:14
Our enrolments at AU are up by 40% … but not sure that’s going to help support upscaled teaching funding ...
Philip Schiff
01:15:15
Interesting. In Australia and New Zealand, there is a large reliance on International Student revenue. The impact has been dramatic
Debra Hoven
01:16:11
@ Philip - hmm - as a fully online university our international enrolment %% haven’t changed
Philip Schiff
01:16:47
AU sounds well positioned to benefit from the laggard Universities
George Veletsianos
01:16:53
I am hesitant to look at short-term enrolments. Ours are up to. But average enrolments are half the picture. International students for instance are down Canada-wide, and those fund a large part of operations.
Robert Bromber
01:17:57
Jon is correct.
Mark Brown
01:17:58
Ed TV was seen as cocaine for the brain!
Sanjaya Mishra
01:18:08
Agree with Jon. EdTech developments conveniently forget previous works.
Debra Hoven
01:18:47
@George - indeed - but Canada suffers from provincially-funds post-secondary models, rather than federal/nation-level models
Debra Hoven
01:18:55
*funded
Robert Bromber
01:19:00
The current buzz is Dreamscape which has as much value as did Second Life!
Mark Brown
01:19:18
Nice review of literature of VR in latest BJET and whilst sceptical opens some interesting possibilities
Thomas Reeves
01:20:09
So much of the research in distance education seems to be “boutique research.” Rather than addressing the serious problems that teachers and learners are experiencing day in and day out during this terrible pandemic, we continue to tinker with little models or new technologies. I think it is high time for us to get serious about addressing these real-world problems (e.g., lack of engagement and motivation on the part of distance learners) rather than “tinkering toward utopia” (to use Tyack and Cuban’s (1995) term). We need to launch major international collaborations akin to those that are going on in public health and medical science, and use the pandemic to engage in much more socially responsible research.
Debra Hoven
01:20:53
Indeed - tinkering around the edges …
Debra Hoven
01:21:29
We have students in Nunavut with satellite internet interrupted by snowstorms, cloudy days - and no phones or cell service at home!
George Veletsianos
01:21:32
@Debra, yes. And AB faces different challenges than BC. Somewhat related, AU’s recent decision to transition to fully remote work (i.e. including executive) I think is spot on.
Thomas Reeves
01:21:37
Here are four things we could do: & Establish an evolving repository of meaningful problems on which the educational technology community could focus their research agendas in collaboration with practi- tioners in schools, universities, industry, and other sectors.& Establish consortia of collaborating researchers, practi- tioners, and funding agencies focused on the most salient problems facing education.& Revise journal structures so that through a combination of traditional print and online open access policies, the existing artificial limits on the length and number of arti- cles are eliminated.& Revise the criteria for peer review in educational technol- ogy research journals to include a focus on trying to make a difference in teaching and learning with technology.& Abandon ill-considered schemes for judging the value of research publications, e.g., impact factors of the journals in which articles are published
Sanjaya Mishra
01:22:52
Thanks Tom Reeves for bringing these issues.
Sanjaya Mishra
01:25:12
Thank you Curt for sharing our work at COL.
Thomas Reeves
01:25:36
Actually five things: 1. Establish an evolving repository of meaningful problems on which the educational technology community could focus their research agendas in collaboration with practitioners in schools, universities, industry, and other sectors.2. Establish consortia of collaborating researchers, practitioners, and funding agencies focused on the most salient problems facing education.3. Revise journal structures so that through a combination of traditional print and online open access policies, the existing artificial limits on the length and number of articles are eliminated.4. Revise the criteria for peer review in educational technology research journals to include a focus on trying to make a difference in teaching and learning with technology.5. Abandon ill-considered schemes for judging the value of research publications, e.g., impact factors of the journals in which articles are published
Mark Brown
01:25:38
Only concern is that no innovation is benign!
Philip Schiff
01:27:59
I agree Mark
Ana-Paula Correia
01:28:18
agreed, Mark. We see it all the time.
Debra Hoven
01:28:29
I agree - nor is any technology
Philip Schiff
01:28:52
What do you mean Debra?
Debra Hoven
01:29:49
@Philip - I mean that technologies (liberally interpreted) can be used for many purposes - like statistics, for example
Mark Brown
01:29:56
The growth of EdTech industry is massive in $ terms and there is a bigger battle looming over who will control HE in an increasingly globally connected (and disconnected) online world. Ed researchers still need to do more work on the macro issues (e.g., business models, unbundling, change to GATTS, etc)
Philip Schiff
01:30:04
Great point Debra
Philip Schiff
01:30:15
Okay... I';ll make an offer here and now...
Mark Brown
01:30:57
A great Irish saying… “If you’re not around the table, then you’re likely to be on the menu!”
Philip Schiff
01:30:58
Anyone who wants to try my software, can have it free for the next 6 months. If you feel it can help your students, they can also have it free for 6 months
Thomas Reeves
01:31:07
Those are very important issues, Mark.
Philip Schiff
01:31:25
At least that way I can hopefully help
Debra Hoven
01:32:14
Thx Philip - accessed how?
Philip Schiff
01:32:38
reach out to me phil@mystudyworks.com or via LinkedIn.
Thomas Reeves
01:33:36
Good point, George, The irony of the academic tenure and promotion process is that we have set this process up ourselves; it has not been mandated from above. We have the power to change it.
George Veletsianos
01:33:37
@ mark. Ha! That’s a great saying!
Mark Brown
01:33:38
Good read in Aust Business Review…. https://www.afr.com/work-and-careers/education/uni-students-prefer-online-learning-study-20201011-p563yr
Philip Schiff
01:33:38
Brilliant Christine
Philip Schiff
01:34:06
Thanks Mark
Debra Hoven
01:34:17
Thanks Mark - looks interesting!
Debra Hoven
01:35:13
@Som - confession forthcoming: I always read the reflections first ;-p
Mark Brown
01:36:12
Thanks all for engaging conversation. Heading off now for some sleep…
Thomas Reeves
01:36:14
Refereed journal publications are still the “gold standard” for promotion and continuing employment decisions in most universities. Schimanski and Alperin (2019) identify the problem writing that most academics agree promotion and tenure reviewers “should encourage peer-reviewed works of high quality, but in practice, the value of publications is often assessed using shortcuts such as the prestige of the publication venue, rather than on the quality and rigor of peer review of each individual item.” There is an increasing tendency of dossiers of people applying for promotion and tenure to include citation rates of papers as well as the impact factors of the journals. Instead of evaluating the merits of scholars for their impact on real-world problems, we continue to focus on assessing scholarship based on what is easy to count such as citation frequencies and impact factors.
Thomas Reeves
01:36:46
Schimanski, L. A., & Alperin, J. P. (2019). The evaluation of scholarship in academic promotion and tenure processes: Past, present, and future. F1000Research, 7. Retrieved from https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6325612.1/s
Sanjaya Mishra
01:41:43
October 19-25 is International Open Access Week!
Ana-Paula Correia
01:41:55
Feel free to reach out to me at correia.12@osu.edu
Debra Hoven
01:42:54
Support for IRRODL is pretty minimal - we do it for the love of DE ;-p
Sanjaya Mishra
01:42:59
Green open access is the way.
Sarah Stein
01:44:14
Have to run to a meeting now. Thank you Som and all for a fantastic webinar. I look forward to getting access to the recording as there have been some sage advice and insightful commentary that I hope to share/use in my ongoing "battle" :) at my university! :D
Sanjaya Mishra
01:44:31
Say no to Article Processing Fee.
Shironica Karunanayaka
01:45:24
Great Discussion...Thank you very much...!!!
Debra Hoven
01:45:46
Thank you Som - and all others presenting and commenting!
Antonina Petrolito
01:45:54
Thank you – great session!
Debra Hoven
01:46:00
Snowing her Som!
Thomas Reeves
01:46:04
Thank you to all these expert speakers.
Debra Hoven
01:46:05
*here
Philip Schiff
01:46:05
Thank you Som and the whole panel
Alanieta Lesuma-Fatiaki
01:46:06
Awesome session